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 Sat May 27, 2006 4:37 pm Neumann microphones |
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I'm close to buying either a Avalon M-5 or DAV BG-1 for a preamp and amd considering either the Nuemann TLM-103 or TLM-193 as a mic..
Which is the better choice and why7? |
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crowning
Inspector Clouseau |
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| Sun May 28, 2006 12:23 am Re: Neumann microphones |
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| Sterling30 wrote: | I'm close to buying either a Avalon M-5 or DAV BG-1 for a preamp and amd considering either the Nuemann TLM-103 or TLM-193 as a mic..
Which is the better choice and why7? |
The TLM-103 is a good general purpose mic, you can't wrong with it.
It's more sensitive as the TLM-193, so if you want to record close miked
drums it's not the first choice.
On the other side TLM-193 has a bit more noise, but nothing to worry
about.
This theoretical limitations aside, considering the price tag of both I'd try them
at a local store or studio to hear which one you like more. |
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Mike Burn
Generally Crazy Guy |
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| Sun May 28, 2006 11:26 am Re: Neumann microphones |
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| Sterling30 wrote: | I'm close to buying either a Avalon M-5 or DAV BG-1 for a preamp and amd considering either the Nuemann TLM-103 or TLM-193 as a mic..
Which is the better choice and why7? |
I think you want to have a solution for your studio, in this case I would prefer the Neumann TLM-193 which is clearly the better vocal mic incl. the better signal-to-noise-ratio and produces good results for instruments which are not too loud (i.e. avoid cranked up Marshall's with this one).
The Neumann TLM-103 is clearly the more versatile mic which offers great live capabilities. I use TLM-103's for my guitar amps live  It is also a fierce snare mic with great brilliance and punch as well as being "sound-shock-proof" (high volume signals). I know that Crowning said something contrary here, but I use TLM-103's since many years on very LOUD stages However the TLM-103 has a certain coloration of the sound and is not really a neutral mic unlike the TLM-193. The TLM-103 tends to sound 'sharp'.
Regarding your selection of mic pre-amplifiers I would say, that you clearly overdo it with a Avalon M-5. For that money you better drop the other mic's, get a cheaper class A pre-amp (i.e. Focusrite VoiceMaster Pro) and get a Neumann U-87 The M-5 can do wonders with a bad mic, but you'll hear no remarkable difference when you use already a Neumann mic. The DAV BG-1 pre-amp is kown for 'coloration' of the sound, this is a matter of taste but I would always get something more neutral (i.e. the Focusrite above). Neumann mic's don't need fancy pre-amps, since the mics themselves are simply a treat, get a solid class-a pre-amp without gimmicks and you'll don't need more, plus you don't have to fight with your EQ lateron because of pre-amps which add already EQ'ing by colorisation. |
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crowning
Inspector Clouseau |
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| Sun May 28, 2006 12:07 pm Re: Neumann microphones |
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[quote="Mike Burn"] | Sterling30 wrote: | | It is also a fierce snare mic with great brilliance and punch as well as being "sound-shock-proof" (high volume signals). I know that Crowning said something contrary here, but I use TLM-103's since many years on very LOUD stages |
No problem with that, I just refered to a friend who fried his when he
close miked Toms (the drums, not ME  )
I personally liked the sound of the TLM-103 with my voice better (even most
people will tell you the opposite), but my voice sucks whatever mic I
use anyway so it doesn't make a big difference.
I'm happy that I have a store nearby where I can try out most things. |
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Mike Burn
Generally Crazy Guy |
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| Sun May 28, 2006 10:01 pm Re: Neumann microphones |
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| crowning wrote: | No problem with that, I just refered to a friend who fried his when he close miked Toms (the drums, not ME )
I personally liked the sound of the TLM-103 with my voice better (even most
people will tell you the opposite), but my voice sucks whatever mic I
use anyway so it doesn't make a big difference.
I'm happy that I have a store nearby where I can try out most things. |
Mic's are always a matter of taste, except if you talk about a Neumann U-87
It doesn't get more neutral (reality) than this one
Apart from that the TLM-103 sounds 'thin' when close mic'ing Toms for example.
Foremost it doesn't like to be hit by a drum stick, that's deadly. I suspect this
happened with your friend's mic, but I don't think your friend really used something like 4xTLM-103 with the fragile and mandatory elastic suspension units for his precious toms. That would be the $ 7,000 tom mic'ing (with 4 toms) LOL This elastic suspension is really a pain because it tends to self-unmounting when mounted in sharp angles (like on a tom), on the other hand you can't mount a TLM-103 on a usual stand (with appropriate adaptor of course), since it picks up too much 'floor-noise/signals' then.
BTW... the service of Neumann is superb!
I recently brought a Neuman KMS 105 to my music store, since it started distorting and losing level, just acting weird. First I thought the guarantee would be expired, that was the case by 2 months, but to my surprise I got 2 weeks later not only a friendly letter from Neumann/Berlin but I was also announced that I don't get a repaired mic but a new one which I was able to pick up for free in my music store a day later with the letter in my hands Maybe your friend should try the same? *hint*
The best results I ever heard for toms close mic'ed you get using AKG-C414B mic's in hyper-cardiodid mode. IMHO Phat and punchy with the just right amount of brilliance and surprisingly good feedback resistance at high monitoring levels on stage. However that's also VERY expensive for the whole drum kit. LOL For our drummer we use btw. always a AKG C-414B IN the bass-drum - it works better than you think
While we are at it and you seem to be informed did you ever check the Electro-Voice RE 27 dynamic mic? Unbelievable bass reproduction and ultra high output level for a dynamic mic. Great for the bass-drum when you have a mixer with bad eq's since the mic has phat punch and kick, nearly no eq'ing necessary and it is also a good choice for brass/trombones! |
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| Sun May 28, 2006 10:49 pm Re: Neumann microphones |
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I'm going to repost something I put on the homerecording.com forum so you'll see what I'm trying to acomplish. My main interest is adding to the quality of the vocals and acoustic guitars and I'm hoping a great pre-amp-mic combo might be a way to accomplish that. But this is the studio equipment I have to work with now.., you tell me is it worth the extra investment or not..
From homerecording.com..
"I'm using a pretty ancient studio as far as technology goes. And early 16 bit version of Cakewalk for mastering and we record to a DA-88 machine, the monitors are Alesis one but we still get pretty decent sound but I would like to improve it if possible. Would investing in something like an Avalon M-5 really make that much of a difference taking into consideration the equipment it will be working with?
Here's a few sound sample for what we're getting now for sound quality.
Acoustic and vocals:
http://www.soundclick.com/pro/view/01/default.cfm?bandid=405459&songid=3888728&c ontent=song
4 instruments & vocals
http://www.soundclick.com/pro/view/01/default.cfm?bandid=405459&songid=2865067&c ontent=song |
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crowning
Inspector Clouseau |
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| Mon May 29, 2006 12:56 pm Re: Neumann microphones |
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[quote="Mike Burn"] | crowning wrote: | LOL For our drummer we use btw. always a AKG C-414B IN the bass-drum - it works better than you think
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Reversed old subwoofer? Works surprisingly good.
| Mike Burn wrote: |
While we are at it and you seem to be informed did you ever check the Electro-Voice RE 27 dynamic mic? |
I don't know nothing about mics
It happened that there was a time when I wanted to find out why
my vocals don't sound as good as I would like them to sound, so
I put away my cheapy condenser mic and tried some real
professional [tm] stuff.
The problem was NOT in the electrical path of the recording chain  |
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Mike Burn
Generally Crazy Guy |
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| Mon May 29, 2006 3:50 pm Re: Neumann microphones |
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| crowning wrote: | | The problem was NOT in the electrical path of the recording chain |
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| Thu Jun 01, 2006 12:00 am |
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| Tue Jun 22, 2010 7:11 am |
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| it is also a good choice for brass/trombones! |
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